AMERON LOFTS
Home of the Oriental Rollers and the Damascenes
Oriental Roller History - From then until Now
Up-dated 7/ 06/ 2010
The books that I could check into, with any authority, were the “The Pigeon” by Wendell M. Levi (1941), the “Encyclopedia of Pigeon Breeds” by Wendell M. Levi (1965) and “Pigeons of North America In the 21st Century” (2008), published by the National Pigeon Association. All three of these books were either written by the same person, or took information from that person. The one and only…, Wendell M. Levi, seems to be the accepted authority on pigeons. So next, I turned to the great internet, which has no equal for unlimited knowledge on seemingly any topic/ subject. There I found the writings of the famous Dale Husband, that he did for the United Oriental Roller Pigeon Association, of which he has been a member for many years. As well as a few others writers. And so…, armed with much information and cross referencing as well, the following is what I have been able to gather on this great breed of pigeon. The land of origin was, in the past called Persia, which was a very large part of Asia. It had many rulers over the centuries and to learn about them, I suggest you Google the subject and you’ll see it is a very extensive subject. Part of this land, which is in the Middle East (formerly a part of Persia) was/ is called Kurdistan. It covered parts of (what is now called) eastern Turkey, northern Iraq, northwestern Iran and smaller parts of northern Syria as well. The Middle East in 66 BC, remained allied with the Romans until AD 384. Then in the seventh century, came the invasion of the Ottoman Empire which also invaded parts of Turkey and northward. This lasted until the twentieth century and finally ended just after World War II....... It is my belief, that all the performing breeds of today, all the tumblers and all the rollers, have the Oriental Roller for their ancestors. It is written that these acrobats were imported into England around 1870. And Ludlow (in Fulton, 1876) called it the “Oriental Roller”; Lyell (1887) called it the “Turkish Roller”; and the “Kurdistan Roller” as a typical “Oriental Roller“. And says it was introduced into England before 1874 by H. P. Caridia. Carl Naether in his "The Book of the Pigeon", 1939 writes: "The Turkish Oriental Roller is doubtless the oldest breed of performing flyer's, it having received mention in Persian manuscripts of the twelfth century.” “It was first introduced into England about 1870 being considered a distinct variety of the Tumbler, then which it had a longer head and back, a stronger beak, and a flat head. James C. Lyell, also writes in his book “Fancy Pigeons”, 1881. “A distinct variety of the tumbler has been lately introduced into this country from Turkey by Mr. H. P. Caridia, of Birmingham, under the name of the Turkish or Oriental Roller. Besides being said to possess all the qualities of a first-rate flier and performer, it is of an original formation. They were first described and illustrated by Mr. J. W. Ludlow, of Birmingham, in the “Fanciers” Gazette of 20th June, 1874. They are longer in head and beak than our tumblers, the head being flatter, and wanting the high forehead, and the beak thicker and stronger. The neck is rather short, as are the legs. The back is hollow, and the tail is carried rather elevated and over the flights. The tail is the most peculiar feature in their formation, it being long and composed of from fourteen to twenty-two feathers, the average being about sixteen. These feathers have no approach or resemblance to a fantail, but lie one over the other in two divisions, showing a slight division or split between them. As common with other verities having an abnormal number of tail feather, a double feather growing form on quill is often seen in this breed. They are of many colours, such as black, white, dun, and almond splash, the blacks being well lustered, and with white black-tipped beaks as is usual with good colored blacks among British tumblers. I have not had any of these rollers myself, but Mr. Ludlow, from whose description I have gathered the above, asserts that they are capital performers and fliers.” So writes Mr. Lyell Dietz (1929) says, “that an ancient Persian manuscript found in Delhi, supposedly belonging to the twelfth century mentions tumbling pigeons. And goes on to divide the Oriental Roller into the Smyrna (formerly called Izmir) (Turkestan) and the Kurdistan. Saying the former variety is longer and more slender than the latter, though both have the characteristic drooping wings and lack of oil duct. “The Oriental Roller was imported to the United States in 1927. There may have been earlier importations, but from this time on, the Oriental Roller has spread all over the U.S. In the early 1930's, they were shipped to Salt Lake City, Utah from New York by J. Leroy Smith to a Mr. Graham who had a great variety in colors and bar patterns. So…., now you know where the Oriental Roller came from. And how this beautiful breed came into existence here in the U.S. And the other is called the “Show” Oriental Roller. Again, there are many fine breeders from which to chose around the U.S. Both are beautiful, both look very much alike to the beginner/ new comer to this breed. BUT…, the fact remains that one is bred primarily for the show cage and the other is still being bred (like it’s ancestors) for it’s performance/ acrobatic skills in the air. One is being bred for it’s looks, while the other is (supposedly), being bred for it’s ability in the air and to out maneuver a BOP, with their acrobatic ways. Please keep in mind the show bred OR can fly (there’s no doubt about that), and some still have inherited some ability to perform. But they are looked upon as show birds for the show cage, NOT to necessarily be able to do any acrobatics in the sky. (May I suggest looking on my links page) When about to purchase an Oriental Roller, ALWAYS clarify to the seller, which type of OR you are wanting to buy, before you purchase. And one more bit of information you should also be made aware of, and that is, that just because an OR can do all sorts of acrobatic maneuvers in the sky, DOES NOT mean that it is hawk (BOP) proof. This is a matter of, or a contest between two fliers. A pigeon flying for fun/ trying to save it’s life and a BOP out to survive by getting a meal. The Oriental may win today, but tomorrow it may meet a better, wiser hawk. Usually the OR will win…, but sometimes not…… There are many types of BOP. Some are too small to take down a pigeon, some don’t live in your neighborhood. Some are to young and just learning and some just know there’s an easier meal elsewhere.
Just know...., that the Oriental Roller bred for performance and acrobatic skills, is the closest breed of pigeon there is known to man, to have the ability to evading hawks (BOP). Not a perfect winner, but usually a great acrobat, none the less..... And always a beautiful bird.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ If you have been to this website before and read the above history that I posted, you may notice that this update is a bite shorter than the original History Page. Since being involved with two different internet message boards and a lot of e-mail correspondence with many different OR breeders. I have come to the following conclusions… 1) Depending on who your talking to, or listening to, or what website your reading from. Seems to give a totally different flavor and beginning of this breed. The country it started in or the area of the world from which it was first viewed, seems to be…, to each his own. It seems, no matter what the historical proof or facts may show, some people just don’t what to believe they are true. And some (probably wisely so) don’t really give a hoot to what the history really is, or says about their birds. They have theirs and that’s enough for them. And I say…., so be it !! So much for history…. 2) As for the different types or kinds of strains of the OR, it seems to come down to the same type of thinking. I’ve got mine…, you get yours and we’ll all be happy. As for me, I’m a pedigree NUT !! I want to know, from which strain or family my birds have come from. Mainly because I’ve found out, that there two basic strains of ORS. Many families in a strain, but still two basic strains. Also, if you have read this far… Please be aware, that this breed like other flying pigeons, must be trained from either your loft or a kit box. You must spend time in the training and a place in which to do that training. With good stock and the proper training, your sure to be very happy with your birds.
attic pottery in the Tel Aviv Museum
The characteristics of the Roller are its long, high tail, consisting of from fourteen to eighteen feathers, one lying over the other in two divisions: its drooping wings, pearl eye, solid color and especially its lack of the oil gland. The Oriental Roller is a swift flier which, if trained well, will perform most satisfactorily in kits. Rarely is the performance of two birds alike. Most breeders of this fascinating pigeon want birds which spin long, fast and tight, which trick, if performed often, is likely to tire them quickly. So far as the nature of the roll is concerned, that is, its depth and its frequency, some fanciers prefer short spinning birds in almost constant action, while others favor those with the longer spin. " So writes Mr. Naether
Kurdistan Oriental Roller dated about 1919
(Member of the United Oriental Roller Association for many years. A "Master Breeder" with over 72 years of experience in the breed, has written some in the past about the Oriental Roller. And now at the age of 85, I’m sure he won’t mind if I quote from some of his writings.)
“The Oriental Roller pigeon origins come from the Middle East and Asian countries, namely Pakistan, Turkey (i.e., Turkistan), Syria, Kurdistan, which is northern Iran, Iraq and other countries in the Asian part of the world.
Orientals are a very old breed and are known for their performance or rolling and their different style of body. It is believed that this bird was used in crossing with other birds to make the present day rollers. The Oriental Roller has stood the test of time and is still in its original form and type. The bird does not have an oil gland, which is one of its characteristics. The Oriental carries its wings below its tail and it has more than the normal twelve tail feathers. An average of fourteen to sixteen is common.
The old writing about Orientals gives the colors as black, dun, almonds (various combinations of almonds.) Some show mostly black and white, dun and white, and the standard almond background color. No doubt there were many other colors, but these are mentioned most. Now, we have just about every color in Orientals that there are in pigeons.
In the past, the Oriental Roller had lemon or yellow eyes as well as pearl eyes, but over the years the lemon eye was bred out. Now, it is rare to see a bird with lemon eyes. Whites have dark or bull eyes, but some breeders are trying to breed them with pearl eyes so there are a few of them around now.
The Oriental does not fly in a kit as well as does the Birmingham Roller. They prefer to be more individuals and do their own thing in the air. Smaller kits of ten to fifteen birds do much better than larger ones.
Dale Husband 1939
Dale Husband in front of his home loft 1955
Mr. Graham sold his birds to Paul Buttle who kept them until 1938 or 1939 when I was able to acquire his entire loft. There were yellows and reds, silver bars, buff bars and blue bars, bronze and some colors that are not named. I think it was about 1940 that Bob Evens sent me two pair of black Oriental Rollers that he had bred and flown. Bob disposed of his Orientals when he started raising Pensom Rollers.
I got started in Oriental Rollers in 1936. A small blue hen strayed in with my father's Racing Homers. I liked what I saw but didn't know what kind of pigeon it was so I went to my friend, Ray Gilbert, to find out and he told me it was an Oriental Roller. From then on, I was going all over the valley looking for any I could acquire. Friends would tell me where I could find some, then I would buy or trade for the Orientals.
From that time on, the Oriental Roller has made its mark in Salt Lake City, gaining from a few breeders in the 1930's to a great many now.
Some of the people who had Orientals in the 1930's and 1940's are: Paul Buttle, Melvin Colt, Jake Denter, Stever Peterson, Paul Bradford, John Fife, Wayne Myers, Norm Drecksel, Billy Woodruff, Professor Reed, Dave Camomile, and Dale Husband.”
(The above statements about the dates of arrival into America. As well as the dates given of ownership, by different people in the western part of the U.S.. Seems to contradicted, conflict and prove wrong, some of the dates and time periods talked about in some articles, published years ago and also reprinted on the internet. Also, said articles implied, that Mr. Husband bred for the show type Oriental, when in fact, he has never done so. He has ALWAYS bred from the skies and NOT for the show cage. He has shown his bird in the shows, as well as been a judge many times. But he has NEVER bred his birds, for the show cage itself.)
Other importations to America have come form Germany, one of the popular countries for good Oriental Rollers. One of the top breeders there is a Hartmut Fehrholz in Dueren, who has produced over the years many top performing Orientals. He sent four pairs of his “Fehrholz” stock over to a breeder Andy Estrada in California back in 1998. Who has now bred and sold many across the country. So all the Fehrholz Oriental lines in the U.S, seemingly are line bred from those eight birds of Mr. Estrada. Mr. Fehrholz got his Oriental breeding stock from a Mr. Guenter Erkens, and so the line breeding continues.
Almanac Vol 2 print
“There are many false ideas about the Oriental Roller in this country. Some are so prevalent that the false idea is taken for fact and is “common knowledge” in the pigeon fancy. Many of these ideas have been around for some time and are usually regarded as true because it appeared in print at some time, or an opinion leader in the pigeon fancy said it is so. Some of the ideas are relatively new but just as untenable. A few of the more common false ideas about the breed are listed below with an attempt at correcting them.
This is the most common falsehood about the breed! I have listened to more than a few fanciers describe how they’ve seen Oriental Rollers fly all over the sky and never kit. Maybe there is or was a strain of Oriental Roller without kitting ability that I’m not familiar with. Oriental Rollers were kit pigeons back in the late 60’s when I first flew them. More recently, I’ve flown just about every strain available in this country and some from recent imports out of the Middle East and Europe. All fly in kits. Oriental Rollers have a strong instinct to kit. So much so that one weak flier in the kit will bring the entire team down. Oriental Roller kits are loose with the lead pigeon constantly changing. There is a nervous shifting and flitting in the kit and if the team is too large the kit may break up into two or three individual kits but eventually re-group into one team. A kit of Oriental Rollers appear rough and rowdy in the air compared to the orderly, regimented appearance of a kit of Birmingham Rollers. None the less, they do kit and should kit well.
These and other ideas are performance related. There are very few fanciers in this country with substantial experience flying the breed, but there are many that know all about how the breed is a mediocre performer. The fact is there are all sorts of styles, depths and velocities in the roll seen in the Oriental Roller. Some of the deepest rollers I’ve seen have been Oriental Rollers. They can also spin with high velocity though I’d stop short of saying they are as fast as the best Birmingham Rollers. Oriental Rollers generally perform to their full potential when flown in kits of their own kind and the kit performance can be spectacular.
While it is true that the State of Utah and more specifically the Salt Lake City area has long been a hot bed for Oriental Rollers since at least the mid-1930’s, the breed has had a following as a flying breed in other sections of the country. Fanciers were at least semi-active working with the performing type Oriental Roller in parts of the Mid-West and on both coasts prior to 1995. Currently the breed is found in most parts of the country.
How this idea came into being I can’t say. I’ve been hearing this lately and it is patently false. The Oriental Roller is an ancient breed originating somewhere in Asia Minor or in the Middle East and can still be found in these regions. It is documented that some of the first imports of the breed into this country came out of Turkey and shipped to a zoo in New York in the late 1920’s. In 1998, I received a few pairs directly from the Middle East and these are nearly identical in type to our flying / performing Oriental Rollers.
It is true Oriental Rollers have no oil duct. In fact if the pigeon does have an oil duct it is definitely not an Oriental Roller. However, the lack of an oil duct has no apparent ill effect on the pigeon. The absence of the oil duct may be compensated for by the over abundance of oil quills common in the breed. These pigeons can appear to get more water soaked only because the flying feathers are proportionally longer than in many other flying breeds and not because of a lack of oils. The Oriental Roller is an exceptionally sturdy breed that is long lived and seems resistant to many pigeon diseases.
Yes, some specimens of Oriental Roller shake their necks to some degree or another. However, the issue of this trait being desirable is at least questionable. None of the Oriental Rollers from the recent imports out of Germany and the Middle East are neck shakers. Neck shaking appears from time to time in my stock as a recessive trait. In 1997 I bred for the trait and in 1998 I flew 6 young birds with visible neck tremors. Every one of these rolled down. So, it seems that neck shaking is definitely not a desirable trait as far as my Oriental Rollers are concerned. This trait in another strain might be fine. "
Almanac Vol 2 print
There is one more piece of information you should probably know about this breed. And that is, the Oriental Roller has developed into two different types in America. One is now called the “Flying” Oriental Roller (for performance in the sky). Which rest assured, there are many breeders around this country, that have very good performing stock.
